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Post by EscapeHatch on Aug 23, 2010 16:56:21 GMT -5
That this is an issue at all shows there is not a lot going on in the world. I'd say that that was pretty shallow thinking on your part to assume that others are so shallow. Then again, fans of ComiCon tend to be two dimensional. |
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Post by EscapeHatch on Aug 23, 2010 17:14:43 GMT -5
Call me short-sighted, petty or ignorant, if you will, DJ.
I call their silence, not the lack of volume or rancor, to the carpet.
Muslims (in general) in American may have had nothing to do with 9/11 and may well have not supported it. The lack of PUBLIC outcry, no matter how tame or vociferous is MY problem.
I can't say I know lots of Muslims. I can say that I know some. I can recall the feelings, spoken in private, about their disgust with fanatical extremism. I can also recall their lack of understanding why their leaders took so long to join other Americans in the outcry.
I speak only about MY limited brush with the news outlets and my very cloistered view of the world. Had I seen or heard more, I may be singing a different song.
But, I did see people dancing in streets around the world. I did see groups in this very country dancing and even demanding our death. Is that a typical Muslim in America? I certainly do not think so. But, since Islam is the fastest growing religion in this world, even AFTER 9/11, it defies understanding in my limited, petty and ignorant philosophy that I cannot even see how that growth took a decided upturn after that day nearly ten years ago.
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Post by Jack on Aug 23, 2010 17:48:39 GMT -5
Call me short-sighted, petty or ignorant, if you will, DJ. I call their silence, not the lack of volume or rancor, to the carpet. Muslims (in general) in American may have had nothing to do with 9/11 and may well have not supported it. The lack of PUBLIC outcry, no matter how tame or vociferous is MY problem. I can't say I know lots of Muslims. I can say that I know some. I can recall the feelings, spoken in private, about their disgust with fanatical extremism. I can also recall their lack of understanding why their leaders took so long to join other Americans in the outcry. I speak only about MY limited brush with the news outlets and my very cloistered view of the world. Had I seen or heard more, I may be singing a different song. But, I did see people dancing in streets around the world. I did see groups in this very country dancing and even demanding our death. Is that a typical Muslim in America? I certainly do not think so. But, since Islam is the fastest growing religion in this world, even AFTER 9/11, it defies understanding in my limited, petty and ignorant philosophy that I cannot even see how that growth took a decided upturn after that day nearly ten years ago.  You're not "short-sighted, petty or ignorant" on this topic. They did dance in the streets of Detroit and there was a San Diego connection to the 9/11 attacks. And I never heard anybody make an apology that wasn't couched with plenty of excuses that blamed us. |
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Post by Turk on Aug 23, 2010 19:52:48 GMT -5
Works for me |
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Post by Turk on Aug 23, 2010 20:30:07 GMT -5
After Obama’s semi-endorsement of the Mosque opposition to the Mosque grew by 8% . We’ll be in deep trouble when Obama starts endorsing republicans.
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Post by Tired in CV on Aug 23, 2010 20:38:40 GMT -5
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Post by jdredd on Aug 23, 2010 21:01:40 GMT -5
That this is an issue at all shows there is not a lot going on in the world. I'd say that that was pretty shallow thinking on your part to assume that others are so shallow. Then again, fans of ComiCon tend to be two dimensional. I call 'em like I see 'em, and if people are offended, so be it. Does calling Comic-Con fans two dimensional offend me? Ask what I think about sports fans. |
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Post by EscapeHatch on Aug 23, 2010 21:11:26 GMT -5
Oh yeah!!
Perhaps some things mean something that don't mean the same to others.
Go ahead and call them. JD. As long as they are not called into the arena for a blood fight, I am all for exchanges.
As long as we understand what rankles those with genuine feelings.
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Post by Tired in CV on Aug 23, 2010 21:23:56 GMT -5
dj - I think you are correct about the Vermont cross issue. It is a violation of procedures of what was permitted. Of course, we are getting "filtered" information and it could be a very good "excuse" to remove the cross if their real intentions are religous reasons. No reason to believe so from what is written though and the defensive reasoning just doesn't have much facts to support them.
As for the issue of the mosque, I have to go along with EscapeHatch and Nikki! There is a lot going on with the "extremism" and "expansion" all at the same time and the moderates have done little to settle my suspicions. To silent for to long, at least some are speaking up against the proposed mosque site (park51) or is it "area51"?
I would like to be as reassured as you are on this issue, it just isn't happening for me. We had a brief discussion concerning how our government could withstand changing from the political ideology of Islam, yet I still believe that our government can be changed.
Jack mentioned Detroit and there is a whole story right there about how our government can change. It is happening there just like it has happened thoughout Europe and other countries. They have lost hundreds of thousands of people and went from 4th largest city to 11th by people fleeing the city. The muslim population has been growing while everyone else is fleeing this city. The Crime rate is skyrocketing, murders go 70% unsolved, the literacy rate in the schools are sinking below 50% and there are neighborhoods the police won't venture into (similar to France?) due to the muslims. This city is on its way to being a Muslim "mini nation". They provide a strong muslim voting base and working on voting in strictly muslims.
This isn't the only city they have "targeted" in this manner and there are a couple of states that they are targeting as well. They intend to take power through the voting booths and adopt/change laws as necessary. Just like Europe, our government will not interupt a cities government even if they violate the law. Our sanctuary cities are beginning to prove that.
Therefore, cities will begin adopting sharia law which will basically force non-muslims to move from their homes to live elsewhere. One city secured, move on to the next city! Eventually, they will gain offices in county, state and federal positions where they will support the Islamic political agenda. This is not a fast process, but it is being carried out successfully overseas and has several STRONG footholds in the U.S. already.
It is these examples that makes it difficult to believe, as you do, that the extremist Muslims will have little success here. Unfortunately, a lot of moderate Muslims have supported them so that they could practive their religion more freely about their communities. The political faction of the extremist Muslims have also built in fear to other muslims to mind themselves and not support the "non-believing infidel". This is why so many Muslims don't speak out against various actions, the fear of who may "report" them and the retribution upon them!
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Post by jdredd on Aug 23, 2010 22:13:13 GMT -5
Oh yeah!! Perhaps some things mean something that don't mean the same to others. Go ahead and call them. JD. As long as they are not called into the arena for a blood fight, I am all for exchanges. As long as we understand what rankles those with genuine feelings. Dammit, you called my bluff, hatch. Sports fans are just like Comic-con fans, just looking for some entertainment to pass the time. |
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Post by dj on Aug 24, 2010 0:43:45 GMT -5
Call me short-sighted, petty or ignorant, if you will, DJ. I call their silence, not the lack of volume or rancor, to the carpet. Muslims (in general) in American may have had nothing to do with 9/11 and may well have not supported it. The lack of PUBLIC outcry, no matter how tame or vociferous is MY problem. I can't say I know lots of Muslims. I can say that I know some. I can recall the feelings, spoken in private, about their disgust with fanatical extremism. I can also recall their lack of understanding why their leaders took so long to join other Americans in the outcry. I speak only about MY limited brush with the news outlets and my very cloistered view of the world. Had I seen or heard more, I may be singing a different song. But, I did see people dancing in streets around the world. I did see groups in this very country dancing and even demanding our death. Is that a typical Muslim in America? I certainly do not think so. But, since Islam is the fastest growing religion in this world, even AFTER 9/11, it defies understanding in my limited, petty and ignorant philosophy that I cannot even see how that growth took a decided upturn after that day nearly ten years ago. Hatch, I'm sure you know by now I don't consider you short-sighted, petty, or ignorant. As you can see by my comment I considered the validity and appropriateness of each word before ultimately rejecting them all. I went with the word "wrong." I do think you're wrong on this issue, but I hope you don't consider that an insult, it is merely my opinion. I typed out a quite eloquent apology earlier but lost the whole text when I was booted from my connection. This post as a substitute I pray will suffice. In reality I think  |
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Post by dj on Aug 24, 2010 0:46:09 GMT -5
Call me short-sighted, petty or ignorant, if you will, DJ. I call their silence, not the lack of volume or rancor, to the carpet. Muslims (in general) in American may have had nothing to do with 9/11 and may well have not supported it. The lack of PUBLIC outcry, no matter how tame or vociferous is MY problem. I can't say I know lots of Muslims. I can say that I know some. I can recall the feelings, spoken in private, about their disgust with fanatical extremism. I can also recall their lack of understanding why their leaders took so long to join other Americans in the outcry. I speak only about MY limited brush with the news outlets and my very cloistered view of the world. Had I seen or heard more, I may be singing a different song. But, I did see people dancing in streets around the world. I did see groups in this very country dancing and even demanding our death. Is that a typical Muslim in America? I certainly do not think so. But, since Islam is the fastest growing religion in this world, even AFTER 9/11, it defies understanding in my limited, petty and ignorant philosophy that I cannot even see how that growth took a decided upturn after that day nearly ten years ago. You're not "short-sighted, petty or ignorant" on this topic. They did dance in the streets of Detroit and there was a San Diego connection to the 9/11 attacks. And I never heard anybody make an apology that wasn't couched with plenty of excuses that blamed us. Jack, The story that there were Muslims dancing in the streets in Detroit is a myth. Total BS. It is unfortunate that people are still falling for it 9 years after the fact. |
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Post by dj on Aug 24, 2010 1:21:20 GMT -5
dj - I think you are correct about the Vermont cross issue. It is a violation of procedures of what was permitted. Of course, we are getting "filtered" information and it could be a very good "excuse" to remove the cross if their real intentions are religous reasons. No reason to believe so from what is written though and the defensive reasoning just doesn't have much facts to support them. As for the issue of the mosque, I have to go along with EscapeHatch and Nikki! There is a lot going on with the "extremism" and "expansion" all at the same time and the moderates have done little to settle my suspicions. To silent for to long, at least some are speaking up against the proposed mosque site (park51) or is it "area51"? I would like to be as reassured as you are on this issue, it just isn't happening for me. We had a brief discussion concerning how our government could withstand changing from the political ideology of Islam, yet I still believe that our government can be changed. Jack mentioned Detroit and there is a whole story right there about how our government can change. It is happening there just like it has happened thoughout Europe and other countries. They have lost hundreds of thousands of people and went from 4th largest city to 11th by people fleeing the city. The muslim population has been growing while everyone else is fleeing this city. The Crime rate is skyrocketing, murders go 70% unsolved, the literacy rate in the schools are sinking below 50% and there are neighborhoods the police won't venture into (similar to France?) due to the muslims. A large nk of this is fear-mongering bafflegab. Just over 40% of the downtown population in Detroit is Muslim, but almost 55% is Christian. Detroit went from 4th to 11th in population because the downtown area is small and urban sprawl sent most of the wealthier citizens to the suburbs in the 1950's and 1960's. And yes much of this what "white flight." Notice however we're talking about white flight, from black dominated areas. Not Christian flight, from Muslim dominated areas. Any attempt to turn this religious is revisionism. Nonsense. And what exactly is the "Islamic political agenda?" Burkas? Stoning? Please. Sorry, but I'll stick with what I've seen. I see 5 Million to 7 Million Muslims living in the United States peacefully among the rest of us non-Muslims. There are THOUSANDS of mosques in the U.S. Where is all the terrorism? All this distrust of American Muslims is because they didn't protest loudly enough about 9/11. This is absurd. |
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Post by nikki on Aug 24, 2010 2:27:51 GMT -5
I think that the State Department has egg on its face, but they will never admit it. Nightline actually did about five minutes on this Ground Zero Mosque Imam. Holy crap! If they decided to give a precious five minutes, you gotta know that they are dipping their toes into what just might be a real story!! www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=38673We have every right to question where the funding of this mosque is coming from, and we damn had better not be intimidated from doing so. |
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Post by Jack on Aug 24, 2010 12:02:47 GMT -5
You're not "short-sighted, petty or ignorant" on this topic. They did dance in the streets of Detroit and there was a San Diego connection to the 9/11 attacks. And I never heard anybody make an apology that wasn't couched with plenty of excuses that blamed us. Jack, The story that there were Muslims dancing in the streets in Detroit is a myth. Total BS. It is unfortunate that people are still falling for it 9 years after the fact. OK, we'll set the "Detroit" thing aside and then we're still left with the dancing in the streets (filmed), the San Diego connection and the non-apologies that basically blamed us for the violent attacks. |
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