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Post by tpfkalarry on Apr 16, 2009 17:22:17 GMT -5
Sounds like body counts. Eventually the Mexican authorities will have seized a million guns from the drug cartels. It is easier to inventory them if they are the same guns each time. I say if one is not going to guard their guns they should consider guarding the bullets. I say let the drug cartels buy guns, just don't let them get their hands on any bullets. Is this simple or what.
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Post by bruce on Apr 16, 2009 20:05:01 GMT -5
The weapons seized were,for the most part,smuggled in from Texas and California.The constant attempts to put down the Mexican army and (yes,often corrupt) police are pointless.Do you know how many law enforcement officers have lost their lives fighting the cartels?In large part because we have an insatiable desire for illicit drugs.I know I sound like a broken record,but if we didn't use these drugs,there would be no cartels.No billions of dollars,no drug trade.
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Post by EscapeHatch on Apr 16, 2009 20:21:03 GMT -5
There can be no rational argument that the demand has to be eliminated in this country. Keep hammering on that, Bruce. We, as a nation, need to get it through our heads.
I go back to Nancy Reagan's "Just Say No!" Had that advice been universally heeded, we would be in a different place today.
But, would we? No, Bruce, I do not intend to take away from the wisdom of your warnings. But, had there not been the robust drug trade, the energies of the angry, ignorant and hopelessly poor in Mexico would have had nothing, except illegal migration into this country, for work.
And what of that work? If they weren't willing in the first place to find honest work, what else would they seek? We already know that a significant segment of those here illegally that participate as distributors of drugs are illegal aliens themselves, what else would they have done to make money? What would they have done to make AS MUCH MONEY AS THEY COULD MAKE DISTRIBUTING DRUGS ON THE LOCAL LEVEL?? I can gara-damn-tee ya that they will do something else legal to make big money. That won't be mowing lawns or washing cars.
We let them into this country, ignoring propensity to violence and harm, and now that they are here, they will make money.
How do we solve this?
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CM
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Post by CM on Apr 16, 2009 21:10:01 GMT -5
Hatch, where were you when I was trying to learn English? (and still trying over and over again) Close the border.
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Post by tpfkalarry on Apr 16, 2009 21:52:25 GMT -5
Just Say No...
Do you say that to addicts?
Close the border
To our largest trading partner?
I think my bullet idea was much better. The same strategy would work for drugs. Let them buy cocaine but not straws. Let them buy heroin but not hypodermics. Let them buy marijuana but not twinkies. Ba da bing.
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Post by bruce on Apr 17, 2009 6:12:33 GMT -5
The "Just Say No" was a publicity stunt and totally ineffective,just like the WIN badges.Anybody remember them?
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Post by EscapeHatch on Apr 17, 2009 8:56:40 GMT -5
Larry, Bruce, you are missing my point about using "Just Say No". You should recall that drug use was rampant and a movement was in full force to move drugs into the realm of public acceptance. We conservatives wanted to rid our society of drug abuse and we cannot now say that current drug abuse, the basis for high demand, is not the problem. "We" said it was a problem then and ought not to deny it now for ideological reasons. If a guy like Bruce says it's a problem, we can't go back on our historic position and say it's not just because we don't like Bruce's views. CM, English Lesson #2: Thems is the facts as I sees 'em.
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Post by tpfkalarry on Apr 17, 2009 9:25:37 GMT -5
Hatch, What we ought to realize is that the war on drugs has lasted longer than any other war. It has cost us dearly like all the others. We need a new strategy. We also need to understand that we can reform immigration, close the border if that is what you honestly think is best, and when it is all said and done we will still have a drug problem.
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Post by bruce on Apr 17, 2009 9:54:43 GMT -5
We're not going to "close" the border.Mexican citizens spend close to $3 billion a year on this side,not just in la Vista and other south bay cities,but at Horton Plaza,Mission Valley and Fashion Valley.Many la Vista businesses,including Wal Mart,Home Depot,Costco etc make 40-60% of their sales to Mexican residents.Home Town Buffet on Palomar St has about 75% of it's customers from the south.Great way to create a real depression in San Diego.Check with the la Vista chamber of commerce if you think these figures are out of line.
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CM
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Post by CM on Apr 17, 2009 10:18:54 GMT -5
The addiction rate in the US has remained static since 1910 at 4.7%. The thirst for drugs has not changed in a 100 years. Winning the war on drugs is an illusion.
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Post by EscapeHatch on Apr 17, 2009 11:35:39 GMT -5
Larry, is English a second language for you, too?? Is misundertaking what someone says because of a genetic defect?
English Lesson 203: "Jeez Louis".
Of course, this has nothing to do with the truth of your statement. Well said, even if it was from left field. ;D
Bruce, sealing the border in a way that stops the flow of people north and south would devastate local economies. I can't think of anyone that wants that to happen.
A few years ago, I had a young man working for me that grew up in the San Diego area and graduated high school here. I think he was born and raised in La Jolla. He was an American citizen. His parents were dual nationality- Mexican and American. They lived and worked here legally. His sister was sent to Mexico to attend some parochial girls school. They were able to travel back and forth with ease.
These are not the people whose flow back and forth we need to control. They are already "under control"- they did things legally.
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Post by tpfkalarry on Apr 17, 2009 12:08:28 GMT -5
Does that mean you are "seeing the light"?
How many legs does a dog have it you call a tail a leg? Just across the border in TJ you would say three or even less if you only count the straight ones or the ones that are full size. It always amazes me how many dogs seem to survive over there with so many physical problems or challenges. You don't see so many dogs like that on this side of the border.
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Post by EscapeHatch on Apr 20, 2009 18:48:10 GMT -5
Does that mean you are "seeing the light"?
... Larry, I believe I've been consistent in the flow of commerce across the border with the only exception of boycotting Mexico in certain target industries. There is no new "light" that I am aware of. And I know many that, like me, are against "illegal aliens" coming into this country and being given a pass while at the same time welcoming anyone with a credit card and a home to go home to. This does not mean "Welcome to America, NOW LEAVE!" It means that we want people to come and enjoy tourism, shopping, trade opportunities and our people and do so lawfully.
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Post by bruce on Apr 20, 2009 20:40:43 GMT -5
.....and do so lawfully".That set me off.I spent much time in Ensenada in the 80's and TJ in the 90's.In TJ I was in areas that never see a turista,but in Ensenada I spent a lot of time on Calle Primera,the tourist zone.I saw middle class looking men in their 40's rolloing around in the street,fighting.The police came and one of the men tried to walk away.The cop said"Stop"Come here" in English.The guy kept walking and the cop went after him.The man turned around and kicked the cop in the shin.He was finally subdued. A man was punching a female in the face.They were in a hotel parking lot.A little bot about 6 was yelling"Daddy,stop,stop etc"The man came over and punched the kid in the stomach.He went down and by this time several employees from the nearby taco stand inervened and held him for the police.The little boy got up and was crying.A slightly older kid,very dark and almost certainly an Indian,dressed in near rags,camw over and put his arm aroung the other boy.The guy went to jail. Three guys were walking down Calle Primera drinking beer.A cop confronted them and told them to pour out the beer.They did so,and then one of them hit the cop over the head with his bottle,knocking him out.They walked away. The most despicable incident happen when three guys(unfortunately they looked like military due to their haircuts) were in front of the Bahia hotel,one of them getting his shoes shined.When the kid was done,he said "50 cents",in English.The guy said"You've just been screwd" and the three started to walkaway.The kid,maybe 10 or 11,sais"50 cents"twice more.Suddenly the guy turned around and ran back and kicked the kid's wooden shoeshine bos down the street,smashing it and breaking the liquid polish.All three walked away laughing.I said something and they threatened me.I gave the kid $20(no partying tonight) but was rewarded with the widest smile.Roberto now lives in Yuma and works for the Yuma County Probation Department.
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Post by Jack on Apr 20, 2009 21:26:37 GMT -5
.....and do so lawfully".That set me off.I spent much time in Ensenada in the 80's and TJ in the 90's.In TJ I was in areas that never see a turista,but in Ensenada I spent a lot of time on Calle Primera,the tourist zone.I saw middle class looking men in their 40's rolloing around in the street,fighting.The police came and one of the men tried to walk away.The cop said"Stop"Come here" in English.The guy kept walking and the cop went after him.The man turned around and kicked the cop in the shin.He was finally subdued. A man was punching a female in the face.They were in a hotel parking lot.A little bot about 6 was yelling"Daddy,stop,stop etc"The man came over and punched the kid in the stomach.He went down and by this time several employees from the nearby taco stand inervened and held him for the police.The little boy got up and was crying.A slightly older kid,very dark and almost certainly an Indian,dressed in near rags,camw over and put his arm aroung the other boy.The guy went to jail. Three guys were walking down Calle Primera drinking beer.A cop confronted them and told them to pour out the beer.They did so,and then one of them hit the cop over the head with his bottle,knocking him out.They walked away. The most despicable incident happen when three guys(unfortunately they looked like military due to their haircuts) were in front of the Bahia hotel,one of them getting his shoes shined.When the kid was done,he said "50 cents",in English.The guy said"You've just been screwd" and the three started to walkaway.The kid,maybe 10 or 11,sais"50 cents"twice more.Suddenly the guy turned around and ran back and kicked the kid's wooden shoeshine bos down the street,smashing it and breaking the liquid polish.All three walked away laughing.I said something and they threatened me.I gave the kid $20(no partying tonight) but was rewarded with the widest smile.Roberto now lives in Yuma and works for the Yuma County Probation Department. Bruce, I hereby award you today's "Broad Brush" award. jdredd was judged first runner up. Jack Oliver was eliminated by the judges and failed to place.
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