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Post by jdredd on Jun 19, 2009 13:36:31 GMT -5
This thread was inspired by a History Channel special about the hippies basically blaming them for everything that has gone bad in America in the last 40 years, including Disco and rust. I have a few personal observations:
1. They were blamed for the skyrocketing divorce rate of the 60's and 70's. I blame Hugh Hefner for that.
2. I think they benefited society in at least one way: they were the inspiration for millions of last-minute Halloween party costumes.
3. They did manage to traumatize almost a whole generation of conservatives.
4. Charles Manson was not a hippie, no more than Adolph Hitler was a conservative. (AH had some similiarities to conservatives such as love of the military and hatred of modern art, but he was not one) Real hippies hated guns and violence. No wonder they went extinct.
For full disclosure I must admit I was a hippie wanabee, but I wasn't cool enough to actually be one.
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Post by dj on Jun 19, 2009 14:51:06 GMT -5
4. Charles Manson was not a hippie, no more than Adolph Hitler was a conservative. (AH had some similiarities to conservatives such as love of the military and hatred of modern art, but he was not one) We can't pretend that the term "conservative" in one country is always going to be equivalent in another. By its very definition, a conservative is one who wishes very little change in the existing state. Obviously, one has to look at the state itself to determine who is relatively conservative or radical. A simplistic view is that since he was overthrowing the government he is a "radical". Of course, that's simplistic. He was first and foremost a nationalist. He was highly patriotic, fought in WWI, and was devestated with the subservient position Germany was put into at the Armistice. Please, don't anyone try to claim Hitler was "socialist" since by gosh the very word "socialist" is in the name of his political party. Three things to understand are 1. Hitler despised the Socialists to the core. It's in his writings. 2. He was politically savvy. His German Workers Party was formed with a first priority of gaining broad support from the masses and taking them from the Socialist Party. The name was changed to the National Socialist Party to futher appeal to the worker class AND to distinguish it from the better known Socialist Party. He was co-opting the term for his own uses. 3. He was false. His friend and protector Ernst Roehm was put in charge of the Storm Division (the "brownshirts") in deference to his loyalty to Hitler, abut despite Roehms dreams of a Socialist Revolution. After Hitler had gained a great measure of power with help from the now 2 Million member storm division, the two were at odds almost constantly, MOSTLY BECAUSE Roehm and the leadership in the Storm Division were committed Socialists. Roehm even wrote and spoke of a second socialist revolution, making him dangerous to Himmler and the rest of Hitler's decided NOT-Socialist party. By all accounts, Hitler the conservative was having great difficulty with his committed radical Ernst Roehm. In the Night of the Long Knives, Hitler had the entire leadership of the Storm Division arrested and executed. Hitler arrested Roehm himself. Roehm was shot when he refused to commit suicide. Hitler consolidated the Storm Division under himself and established a very pro-business anti-communist government.
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Post by jdredd on Jun 19, 2009 15:05:09 GMT -5
I never meant to imply that Hitler was in any way a leftist, just he was not a conservative in the pro-traditional sense. He certainly was an enemy of socialism and trade unions, but he was also opposed by the Catholics for his anti-clericism, whereas Mussolini had the support of the rch. Mussolini was originally a socialist (but I guess he "wised up" with age, yes?), but Hitler never was.
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Post by johng on Jun 19, 2009 19:38:16 GMT -5
Wow good stuff but so far from the thread of Hippie Hell? I just thought the Hippies were amusing and quite entertaining at times!
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Post by jdredd on Jun 19, 2009 19:46:16 GMT -5
Yeah, who knew Adolph lived in Hippie Hell? He must really be miserable, I doubt he finds them amusing!
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CM
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Post by CM on Jun 20, 2009 0:42:17 GMT -5
Somehow Disco and hippie sounds like oil and water.
1. Skyrocketing divorce rate proves free love had a very high cost. 2. I’m a little slow tonight I don’t get it 3. My parents were horrified when I went to Haight Ashbury for the summer 4. Agree
Hippie prerequisites, you must have:
Smoked dope Attended an orgy Gone a week without bathing Flunked dumbbell English 101 Not know the name of the girl you have been hanging with for a week Stopped wearing underwear
I’ll think of more
Today’s hippie attends the Burning Man festival
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Post by jdredd on Jun 20, 2009 1:47:37 GMT -5
I am shocked, shocked that you would say all those mean things about all those lovable hippies! They are just a misunderstood minority, like, say, cavemen. In fact they share a lot of caveman traits! But go ahead and pick on them, no one cares, I was just amazed at all the goofy stuff that they were saying about them on the History channel. Though I do wonder if they might make a comeback one of these years. Naaaaahhhhh.
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CM
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Post by CM on Jun 20, 2009 9:32:57 GMT -5
I did not see History Channel special, wished I had. I’ve worn many hats and disguises over the decades, but still wear shorts, t-shirt and flip-flops 90% of the time; I’ve gone 7-8 months without wearing shoes. My ONLY tan lines are from flip-flops. 3 pairs of flip-flops, going out to dinner, casual, and work, I’ve tried all the brands - best thus far is Reef, but Ugg has one I have not worn.
There still is a lot of hippie in me; I only wear underwear for my annual physical.
Another you must have:
Attended a Grateful Dead concert
Have you ever been to Burning Man?
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CM
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Post by CM on Jun 20, 2009 9:35:14 GMT -5
p.s. I don't think a person can be an original hippie if they were born after 1950
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Post by lou on Jun 20, 2009 11:57:10 GMT -5
Another Hippie requirement was commune living and of course having at least 1 child named Moonbeam or Clover Leaf or Wind-in-the-Fields or something along these lines.
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Post by lou on Jun 20, 2009 11:57:49 GMT -5
DJ, superb description of Hitler and his politics!
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Post by jdredd on Jun 20, 2009 12:59:32 GMT -5
p.s. I don't think a person can be an original hippie if they were born after 1950 You are probably correct. I remember hitchhiking near San Francisco and getting picked up by a nice-looking older lady (mid to late 20's) in a sports car about 1971. I had long hair and all that and she said she was there with the original hippies in Haight-Asbury about 1967...she had moved on, I wish I had asked why.
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Post by johng on Jun 20, 2009 13:39:29 GMT -5
p.s. I don't think a person can be an original hippie if they were born after 1950 You are probably correct. I remember hitchhiking near San Francisco and getting picked up by a nice-looking older lady (mid to late 20's) in a sports car about 1971. I had long hair and all that and she said she was there with the original hippies in Haight-Asbury about 1967...she had moved on, I wish I had asked why. Even the Hippie "Fun Box" can be worn out... moving on is a safety issue
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Post by jdredd on Jun 20, 2009 14:53:40 GMT -5
You are probably correct. I remember hitchhiking near San Francisco and getting picked up by a nice-looking older lady (mid to late 20's) in a sports car about 1971. I had long hair and all that and she said she was there with the original hippies in Haight-Asbury about 1967...she had moved on, I wish I had asked why. Even the Hippie "Fun Box" can be worn out... moving on is a safety issue Oh, I can think of lots of reasons she would have wanted to move on, I'm just still curious which one it was.
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Post by dj on Jun 25, 2009 18:34:27 GMT -5
I never meant to imply that Hitler was in any way a leftist, just he was not a conservative in the pro-traditional sense. He certainly was an enemy of socialism and trade unions, but he was also opposed by the Catholics for his anti-clericism, whereas Mussolini had the support of the rch. Mussolini was originally a socialist (but I guess he "wised up" with age, yes?), but Hitler never was. All good points.
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